Vaccinations again
Aug. 9th, 2003 05:10 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
quietannso... thanks to a computer crash, I have had several hours to comtemplate the various responses to this whole topic, including especially ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
hawkegirl's.
This all reminds me of a quote from Stalin: "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." And I'd rather avoid the million deaths....
From different points of view, each of us is right. I approach the problem from a public health perspective, which isn't surprising given where I have spent the past 2 years. That is, what leads to the greatest good for the largest numbers of people? The data available to me show that vaccination *in general* (leaving specific diseases aside...) is a good thing by this standard.
hawkegirl OTOH is approaching things as a mother of individual children. If she vaccinated them, and one of them suffered debilitating complications, it would be terrible for her and her family. I don't deny that at all. I don't disagree with her decision, taken as the individual decision of an individual parent. If I had kids, I'd research vaccines carefully, and where I chose to vaccinate, insist on the least risky vaccine available.
However (and I am going out on a limb here), everything I know about epidemics suggests that parents who choose not to vaccinate, whether they acknowledge it or not, are relying on there being enough parents who "don't know any better" and vaccinate their children. This related back to herd immunity; as long as a certain percentage of the population is immune to a disease, outbreaks are likely to be very limited. In fact, they may be so limited that bad reactions to a vaccine are more common than the disease the vaccine is supposed to prevent. So in the immediate sense, the vaccine *is* more risky -- but as fewer kids get vaccinated, this won't remain the case.
What's happening right now with vaccines is that most drug companies don't manufacture them anymore. They are not profitable, especially when the cost of lawsuits is considered. Because of this, there are plans afoot in the CDC to make vaccine manufature a government function -- but this would likely eliminate research into making vaccines safer than they are now. Not a good thing IMHO.
(Another thing: WRT smallpox, we don't have to vaccinate against it any more *precisely because* it has been eliminated from the general population by widespread vaccination. [defense labs aside, but that is another wrinkle for another time...] The same thing is almost true of polio, and could be true of any other disease that is harbored only in humans...)
and one more link: MMR and autism not linked, finds giant study. From an epidemiological perspective, this research is as good as it gets...
hawkegirl's.This all reminds me of a quote from Stalin: "A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic." And I'd rather avoid the million deaths....
From different points of view, each of us is right. I approach the problem from a public health perspective, which isn't surprising given where I have spent the past 2 years. That is, what leads to the greatest good for the largest numbers of people? The data available to me show that vaccination *in general* (leaving specific diseases aside...) is a good thing by this standard.
hawkegirl OTOH is approaching things as a mother of individual children. If she vaccinated them, and one of them suffered debilitating complications, it would be terrible for her and her family. I don't deny that at all. I don't disagree with her decision, taken as the individual decision of an individual parent. If I had kids, I'd research vaccines carefully, and where I chose to vaccinate, insist on the least risky vaccine available.However (and I am going out on a limb here), everything I know about epidemics suggests that parents who choose not to vaccinate, whether they acknowledge it or not, are relying on there being enough parents who "don't know any better" and vaccinate their children. This related back to herd immunity; as long as a certain percentage of the population is immune to a disease, outbreaks are likely to be very limited. In fact, they may be so limited that bad reactions to a vaccine are more common than the disease the vaccine is supposed to prevent. So in the immediate sense, the vaccine *is* more risky -- but as fewer kids get vaccinated, this won't remain the case.
What's happening right now with vaccines is that most drug companies don't manufacture them anymore. They are not profitable, especially when the cost of lawsuits is considered. Because of this, there are plans afoot in the CDC to make vaccine manufature a government function -- but this would likely eliminate research into making vaccines safer than they are now. Not a good thing IMHO.
(Another thing: WRT smallpox, we don't have to vaccinate against it any more *precisely because* it has been eliminated from the general population by widespread vaccination. [defense labs aside, but that is another wrinkle for another time...] The same thing is almost true of polio, and could be true of any other disease that is harbored only in humans...)
and one more link: MMR and autism not linked, finds giant study. From an epidemiological perspective, this research is as good as it gets...
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no subject
Date: 2003-08-09 04:05 pm (UTC)The information that I have read has lead me to a different conclusion then the information you have.
If I believed vaccinating made a difference on the public health persepective, I would probably be saying much the same as you.
It's not that we are approaching it from different agendas. It's that we've come to different conclusions on the subject.
no subject
Date: 2003-08-09 08:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-08-10 03:35 am (UTC)I feel like well-documented facts you are talking about (atleast some of them) are not as well thuroughly researched or honestly presented as you do. I feel like it's way more complicated then that, and these black and white facts are infact very grey.
Again, I'm not saying vaccinating is the wrong choice, but I do believe the lines the government put out or misleading and atleast partially untrue, and I personally believe anyone who comes to a hard and fast decission that either side is *right* and *wrong* probably hasn't done alot of the research - or atleast hasn't come accross much of the research that is not all pro-vaccinating.
no subject
Date: 2003-08-09 06:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2003-08-09 08:27 pm (UTC)Numerous pet peeves of mine are playing in here, most of which I prefer not to mention in semi-public...
no subject
Date: 2003-08-10 04:46 am (UTC)/me tries to put the keyboard down... slowly back away from the computer... (LOL)